The American Republic

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ProvGov: a test Mock Government

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1ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sat Jul 07, 2012 2:11 pm

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
We'll be using this thread to test a government before we integrate the coming government we set up from the Convention.

Scenario: After the events that transpired in 2014 that made a Constitutional Convention necessary, a remaining skeleton of the US Government still exists. It is termed "ProvGov", short for Provisional Government. It is currently waiting for the Convention to finish, as to set up a new Government for the people, by the people, of the people.

"National" Affairs
Anarchists and terrorists still occupy the land.

What Remains:
Pentagon: the Military, scattered
Congress: howbeit, severely reduced
Some Bureaucracy

What Remains Not:
Presidential Office: currently empty
the Cabinet: abolished
Supreme Court
CIA and FBI

Interest Groups:
Tea Partiers
Green Enviromentalists
National Rifle Association
ACME Watchdog

International Affairs

United Nations moved out of NY to Geneva, Switzerland.

Major Nations of the World(and how they relate to us):
Israel ~ diplomacy
China ~various, mainly economy
N. Korea ~ nuclear security
European Union ~ economy
Russia ~ various
Saudi Arabia ~ oil
Mexico ~ immigration issues, drug traffic

ProvGov consists of both Houses of Congress in a somewhat eternal Joint-ish Session/Conference Committee until the Convention finishes.

Starting Test Budget: $1 Billion

Another Agenda List!

Major:
1. Election of the Speaker of the House - Complete
2. Test Legislative Process (proposing bills, [small] committees, floor action, law enactment) - Complete
3. Test Legislation Effects (implementation, bureaucratic entropy) - UNFINISHED

Minor:
1. News Media
2. Lobbyists + Lobbying


State of the Nation:
The ProvGov is barely holding anarchy back. Crime rates are twice as they are now(whatever the current percentage is).
Some want to keep ProvGov as it is, and resist the Convention proceedings.
ProvGov as a whole almost refuses blatantly to discuss foreign issues, if at all. The general consensus is the focus should be on the rebuilding of America.

...

How this may work:
We will elect ourselves in Congress and whatnot. We may take multiple positions at the same time, due to lack of members.

A year in Mock office is equal to a month of real time. Once a term ends, a member is eligible for another position.
(ex: "Sam" is first elected in the House. His term ends. He is eligible to run for Senate, Presidency, but not the House until his new term in the new office expires.)

Election by the populace will be randomized, and is affected by campaigns, media, etc.

Lobbying and internal partisan politics is by PM.

I envision there to be different threads for different branches for the coming Government. As only the Congress exists in ProGov, it will only take this thread.

I also suspect that we will need the manpower of the CP! Forums to maintain the coming one.

A member of the forums is equal to their state's apportionment. Meaning if one is elected to the Senate from their state, his vote would count as two, since two Senators come from each state. If he is elected to the House, he will be equal to how many Representatives that state has. This is to simplify matters.

Issues will be presented by a Congressman, whether a member of the forums or a fictional one. There will be a debate or whatever, and a vote to finalize the legislation. Issues will come from daily news. (ex.: CNN reports a bill pending in Congress, and therefore that bill will be introduced here)

The effects of legislation will be calculated, and is not instantaneous. It will be as realistic as possible, but I cannot guarantee complete objectivity.

(to be edited)

Any suggestions?

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

2ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Tue Jul 10, 2012 11:27 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
Montana: 1 (yes, we are weak and small in size)

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

3ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:12 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
BTW, Sky-opera's is Texas, which hath 32 Representatives (my goodness, I think Texas is the most powerful state in our mock government, uh-oh....)

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

4ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:23 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
High Prince Christopher wrote:BTW, Sky-opera's is Texas, which hath 32 Representatives (my goodness, I think Texas is the most powerful state in our mock government, uh-oh....)

Oh, LOL! Laughing

Now why did you say 32? Where did you get that #?

Because I think there may be more.....

5ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:27 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
sky-opera wrote:
High Prince Christopher wrote:BTW, Sky-opera's is Texas, which hath 32 Representatives (my goodness, I think Texas is the most powerful state in our mock government, uh-oh....)

Oh, LOL! Laughing

Now why did you say 32? Where did you get that #?

Because I think there may be more.....
I got the number from wiki answers, but I also looked it up on [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Anywho, you have 32 reps. and 2 senators.

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

6ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:32 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
High Prince Christopher wrote:
sky-opera wrote:
High Prince Christopher wrote:BTW, Sky-opera's is Texas, which hath 32 Representatives (my goodness, I think Texas is the most powerful state in our mock government, uh-oh....)

Oh, LOL! Laughing

Now why did you say 32? Where did you get that #?

Because I think there may be more.....
I got the number from wiki answers, but I also looked it up on [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Anywho, you have 32 reps. and 2 senators.

Whoa! I can't believe Montana only has one! Wow,

Thanks for the link on that. It looks like a very useful site as far as voting and records go.

7ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Wed Jul 11, 2012 11:45 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
sky-opera wrote:

Whoa! I can't believe Montana only has one! Wow,

All I can say to that is, " Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz Razz "

Thanks for the link on that. It looks like a very useful site as far as voting and records go.

Thou art welcome.

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

8ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Thu Jul 12, 2012 5:51 am

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
Okay, so that would make 51 Representative and 6 Senators. Is that good, or should we add in some more inactive states?

We can do this:
I. (fair-ish, but the election will be decided by much more of a random element)
Christopher (Montana) = 1 Representative and 1-2 Senator(s)
Sky Opera (Texas) = 1-2 Representative(s) and 1 Senator
Jon David (Texas) = 1-2 Representative(s) and 1 Senator
Sam (Ohio) = 1 Representative and 1-2 Senator(s)

OR

II. (most simple, but unbalanced)
Christopher (Montana) = 1 Representative and 2 Senators
Sky Opera (Texas) = 16 Representatives and 1 Senator
Jon David (Texas) = 16 Representatives and 1 Senator
Sam (Ohio) = 18 Representatives and 2 Senators

OR

III. Change the apportionment of each state in light of the events of 2014.



Last edited by gmx0 on Thu Jul 12, 2012 6:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

9ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Thu Jul 12, 2012 9:57 am

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
I'd go with #1. It would allow us to test out the NRC (which I want to see how that will turn out).

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

10ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Thu Jul 12, 2012 1:23 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
BTW, once we start up this mock gov, could you all start your member sheets? They are found on your profile page.

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

11ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Thu Jul 12, 2012 6:11 pm

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
High Prince Christopher wrote:I'd go with #1. It would allow us to test out the NRC (which I want to see how that will turn out).
Well, we could test the first option, then the second.

*Waits for sky's opinion*

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

12ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:34 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator

I don't mind testing both option 1 and 2. Option 3 sounds too complicated to do now.


@Christopher: Pardon my possibly stupid question, but what is the NRC?


*Waits for the President Jon David's opinions.*

13ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:53 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
sky-opera wrote:
@Christopher: Pardon my possibly stupid question, but what is the NRC?
Not-real-congressmen

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

14ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Fri Jul 13, 2012 1:59 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
High Prince Christopher wrote:
sky-opera wrote:
@Christopher: Pardon my possibly stupid question, but what is the NRC?
Not-real-congressmen

Ah, okay. That will be interesting. scratch

I was wondering also how we are going to vote people(ourselves) in office if we have just us?

Are we going to randomize it somehow (like drawing names from a hat) as was alluded to in the above agendas?

15ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sat Jul 14, 2012 7:20 am

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
Yes, randomized. But not completely.

Steps:
1. Count the real votes
2. + Randomized votes based on the effects of the debate, speeches, and general consensus; and the partisan and State leanings of the congressman. So the better your debates and speeches blablahblah, the more likely the not-real congressman to vote for you. The NRC should be split down to partisan lines, so we wont have to simulate their personalities and constituents.

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

16ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sat Jul 14, 2012 10:25 am

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
gmx0 wrote:Yes, randomized. But not completely.

Steps:
1. Count the real votes
2. + Randomized votes based on the effects of the debate, speeches, and general consensus; and the partisan and State leanings of the congressman. So the better your debates and speeches blablahblah, the more likely the not-real congressman to vote for you. The NRC should be split down to partisan lines, so we wont have to simulate their personalities and constituents.

Okay cool! Cool

That sounds good and like it will work.

17ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sat Jul 14, 2012 1:39 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
Sounds good. I think I am ready.

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

18ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sat Jul 14, 2012 4:44 pm

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
Sky Opera, Texas?
Jon David, Texas?
Heather, California?
(any other member of the Forums?)
(list of NRCs called, uses current, assumes you took one place of a Republican congressman...)
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

19ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 12:57 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
gmx0 wrote:Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
Sky Opera, Texas? Here.
Jon David, Texas?
Heather, California?
(any other member of the Forums?)
(list of NRCs called, uses current, assumes you took one place of a Republican congressman...)
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)


So we are in fact having partisan politics? I guess that's really the only way to go otherwise we would come up with our own new names for political parties anyway.

Thank you for the link, that way we can see more of your plans.

20ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 1:57 pm

gmx0

gmx0
High Moderator
High Moderator
sky-opera wrote:
gmx0 wrote:Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
Sky Opera, Texas? Here.
Jon David, Texas?
Heather, California?
(any other member of the Forums?)
(list of NRCs called, uses current, assumes you took one place of a Republican congressman...)
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)


So we are in fact having partisan politics? I guess that's really the only way to go otherwise we would come up with our own new names for political parties anyway.

Thank you for the link, that way we can see more of your plans.
Just to simplify things. Unless you want every NRC to have a random vote.

http://www.neogenerationgames.webs.com

21ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:05 pm

sky-opera

sky-opera
Moderator
Moderator
gmx0 wrote:
sky-opera wrote:
gmx0 wrote:Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
Sky Opera, Texas? Here.
Jon David, Texas?
Heather, California?
(any other member of the Forums?)
(list of NRCs called, uses current, assumes you took one place of a Republican congressman...)
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)


So we are in fact having partisan politics? I guess that's really the only way to go otherwise we would come up with our own new names for political parties anyway.

Thank you for the link, that way we can see more of your plans.
Just to simplify things. Unless you want every NRC to have a random vote.


Okay that makes sense.

22ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:33 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
gmx0 wrote:Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
I am here.
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)
Very well. I believe it is permissible. So... what do I do exactly?

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

23ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:36 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
Never mind. I figured it out.
Once Jon and Heather say they are here, or two days pass without, I will open nominations for Speaker of the House.

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

24ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:14 pm

Christopher S.

Christopher S.
Administrator
Administrator
*out of character* Something to add that I think will help make the legislative process easier for us all, here are some tips in writing a bill:

There are two parts of a bill, the Preamble and the Body.

Preamble: This section should provide your reasons for the necessity of your bill. Why is your topic something that should be addressed by the government? This section's clauses should always begin with a "Where as..."

Body: This section should be separated into sections and subsections. Each proposed idea for the implementation of the bill should be a section. Subsections should be used to provide further detail and clarification (definitions, etc.) for their appropriate bill sections.
Enactment Clause: This is the final section of the bill (and can be labeled as a section as normal). EACH BILL MUST HAVE AN ENACTMENT CLAUSE!! The enactment clause tells your fellow congressmen when your bill will take effect if passed. It may specify a future date (September 30, 2005) or a certain number of days following the passage of the bill (60 days after passage). Enactment dates more than 90 days after passage is used for most legislation and is the enactment period for normal legislation (Although the implementation time for our bills will be much shorter, if not instantly).

sample:

AMERICAN PROVISIONAL GOVERNMENT
Committee: N/A
Principal Author: Representative Joe
Bill No: 1
Delegation:
Title of Bill:
An Act to Reduce Government Subsidy Spending
BE IT ENACTED BY THE AMERICAN PROVISIONAL GOVERNMENT

Preamble: Where as $114,024,265,743 billion has been appropriated to the U.S. Department
of Agriculture (USDA) over the past seven years for subsidies, and since 10% of the total
USDA subsidy payment recipients were paid 65% of the total USDA subsidies in 2002, and
since subsidized farm operations drove small farmers off their land to cause a 15% decline
in the number of farmers from 1987 to 1997, and since the 1994 Uruguay Round Agreement
on Agriculture established parameters for freer worldwide trade,
SECTION 1: This act may be cited as, “Freedom to Farm bill.”
SECTION 2: Individual farmers, farming corporations or corporate entities shall not receive
subsidies if that person or entity makes less than 80% of their income from
agricultural operations
SECTION 3: There shall be a limit of total subsidies per person per year of $150,000.
SECTION 4: A farming commission shall be created by the USDA to assess--
Sub-SECTION A: The concentration of the subsidy payments.
Sub-SECTION B: How subsidies influence productivity.
Sub-SECTION C: The influence of subsidies on--
(A) Rural Poverty
(B) Agricultural Growth
(C) Foreign trade
SECTION 5: There shall be an expansion of the quota buy-out program set by the 2002
Farm Bill.
Sub-SECTION A: The industries subject to the quota buy-out program are the
corn, wheat, rice and sugar industries.
Sub-SECTION B: The USDA will create and implement a buy-out program that
will completely abolish quotas in these industries over the 5 years following the
passage of this bill.
SECTION 6: This bill shall go into effect 91 days after passage.

(This bill does not at all reflect any of my beliefs, nor is it any indicator of what I would like to implement. It is a sample that I got from another Mock Government.)

*back in character*

http://mockgovamerica.forumotion.com

25ProvGov: a test Mock Government Empty Re: ProvGov: a test Mock Government on Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:34 pm

Heather M


Founding User
Founding User
gmx0 wrote:Alright! Brace yourselves! Laughing

Okay, since the first thing we have to do is elect a Speaker of the House. I was reviewing the Congressional traditions and found that the Speaker of the House is decided by the majority party beforehand, but is officially elected on the floor. Since we don't have any partisan affliations(at least that I know of)....

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

I will, uh, appoint myself as the temporary Clerk of the House. And call the roll!

Samuel Garcia, Ohio? Present. (yes, I called myself. Neutral )
Christopher, Montana?
Sky Opera, Texas?
Jon David, Texas?
Heather, California? Here.
(any other member of the Forums?)
(list of NRCs called, uses current, assumes you took one place of a Republican congressman...)
NRCs:
21 Texas Republicans
9 Texas Democrats
12 Ohio Republicans
5 Ohio Democrats
19 Californian Republicans
33 Californian Democrats

(Btw, I will be gone for this week, I appoint the Secretary of the Convention to take my place, if that be permissible?)

I told Sky this, but I want to let you all know as well...I'll be gone all of this week at a family camp with my church, so I'll be unable to participate in the mock government until next week, probably. I'm so sorry for my absence, but please continue without me. Smile



Last edited by Heather M on Wed Aug 01, 2012 10:31 pm; edited 1 time in total

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